Mike,=20

I've thought of "good/bad" things about a new group. I made up a small list=
(please let's make this list bigger):

Bad things:
- [oopic] group has a huge amount of information, and in many times I found=
the answers to my problems on previous e-mails. Besides, if a newbie is ha=
ving problems with an oopic based project, they'll probably find themselves=
digging into [oopic] group to find what they need. So it's really bad for =
freshers.
- people have to change. If they keep on writing on this group, all the eff=
ort would be in vain.

Good things:
- there would be an owner and a moderator, so no more "freebies", "latest j=
obs", offense, useless discussions and other unwanted messages.

Come on guys, if you are really unhappy with the present situation, please =
give opinions. As I sad, a new group would be a complete failure if you don=
't give the necessary support now.

Helder.

----- Mensagem original ----
De: Mike Martin
Para: o...@yahoogroups.com
Enviadas: Sexta-feira, 29 de Agosto de 2008 8:00:32
Assunto: Re: Res: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
G'day Helder
That's a good suggestion. I am thinking sbout it. I'm weighing up the=20
pros and cons. Can you think of any "good/bad/interesting" things to=20
say about a new group?

Mike M.

--- In oopic@yahoogroups. com, Helder Oliveira de Castro=20
wrote:
>
> Why don't you create another Yahoo Group ([newoopic]) ? You could=20
be the owner and moderator of this new group, and we could invite=20
everyone to join the new group by using this oopic group.
>=20
> I really don't mind this change, what I can't stand are=20
these "Freebies" and "jobs" messages, and you guys discussing for=20
more than 2 months the future of this group. And look: and don't post=20
many messages here, I just use it because I'm working with a robot=20
that uses ooPIC.
>=20
> Basically, I'm just a reader.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> ----- Mensagem original ----
> De: Mike Martin
> Para: oopic@yahoogroups. com
> Enviadas: Quinta-feira, 28 de Agosto de 2008 8:16:39
> Assunto: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
>=20
>=20
> Hello members
>=20
> I have received a reply from Yahoo Groups Customer Care regarding=20
> ownership of the list. To be frank it was what I expected=20
> (ie "contact the owner"). So as to make the best possible effort=20
I'm=20
> going to persist with the formal process until it's exhausted and=20
> then determine what to do after that. To that effect I have emailed=20
> the owner asking their intentions. Whether I get a reply or not is=20
> anyone's guess. Below is a copy of the text of the email. I hope=20
it's=20
> to everyone agreement and satisfaction.
>=20
> "Dear OOPic Group Owner
>=20
> I have recently had correspondence with Yahoo! Groups Customer Care=20
> with regard to the ownership and the lack of moderation of the=20
OOPic=20
> group. The group's moderator and owner are now absent from the=20
list.=20
> Also, the group settings are such that it is open to uncontrollable=20
> abuse (eg Membership does not require approval nor do messages=20
> require approval either). In order to effect good conduct in the=20
> group I'm formally asking for control of the group in your absence.=20
> Could you please reply via this email with your intentions=20
regarding=20
> the ownership of this list. Thank you.
>=20
> Mike Martin"
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Novos endere=C3=83=C2=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=83=C2=AA conhece. C=
rie um email=20
novo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail. com.
> http://br.new. mail.yahoo. com/addresses
>=20
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

=20=20=20=20
Novos endere=C3=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=AA conhece. Crie um email n=
ovo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail.com.
http://br.new.mail.yahoo.com/addresses

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------------------



(You need to be a member of oopic -- send a blank email to oopic-subscribe@yahoogroups.com )

Someone tried to start a new group around a year or two ago and it
did not take off. There was a lot of interest in it at first with a
lot of cheering and support. As the way it happens, the existing group
tired of trying to coordinate between two groups and since this group
has the most people already participating the new one faltered.

Just my experience with it. :)

-Gary

--- In o...@yahoogroups.com, Helder Oliveira de Castro
wrote:
>
> Mike,=20
>=20
> I've thought of "good/bad" things about a new group. I made up a
small list (please let's make this list bigger):
>=20
> Bad things:
> - [oopic] group has a huge amount of information, and in many times
I found the answers to my problems on previous e-mails. Besides, if a
newbie is having problems with an oopic based project, they'll
probably find themselves digging into [oopic] group to find what they
need. So it's really bad for freshers.
> - people have to change. If they keep on writing on this group, all
the effort would be in vain.
>=20
> Good things:
> - there would be an owner and a moderator, so no more "freebies",
"latest jobs", offense, useless discussions and other unwanted messages.
>=20
> Come on guys, if you are really unhappy with the present situation,
please give opinions. As I sad, a new group would be a complete
failure if you don't give the necessary support now.
>=20
> Helder.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> ----- Mensagem original ----
> De: Mike Martin
> Para: o...@yahoogroups.com
> Enviadas: Sexta-feira, 29 de Agosto de 2008 8:00:32
> Assunto: Re: Res: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
>=20
>=20
> G'day Helder
> That's a good suggestion. I am thinking sbout it. I'm weighing up the=20
> pros and cons. Can you think of any "good/bad/interesting" things to=20
> say about a new group?
>=20
> Mike M.
>=20
> --- In oopic@yahoogroups. com, Helder Oliveira de Castro=20
> wrote:
> >
> > Why don't you create another Yahoo Group ([newoopic]) ? You could=20
> be the owner and moderator of this new group, and we could invite=20
> everyone to join the new group by using this oopic group.
> >=20
> > I really don't mind this change, what I can't stand are=20
> these "Freebies" and "jobs" messages, and you guys discussing for=20
> more than 2 months the future of this group. And look: and don't post=20
> many messages here, I just use it because I'm working with a robot=20
> that uses ooPIC.
> >=20
> > Basically, I'm just a reader.
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > ----- Mensagem original ----
> > De: Mike Martin
> > Para: oopic@yahoogroups. com
> > Enviadas: Quinta-feira, 28 de Agosto de 2008 8:16:39
> > Assunto: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
> >=20
> >=20
> > Hello members
> >=20
> > I have received a reply from Yahoo Groups Customer Care regarding=20
> > ownership of the list. To be frank it was what I expected=20
> > (ie "contact the owner"). So as to make the best possible effort=20
> I'm=20
> > going to persist with the formal process until it's exhausted and=20
> > then determine what to do after that. To that effect I have emailed=20
> > the owner asking their intentions. Whether I get a reply or not is=20
> > anyone's guess. Below is a copy of the text of the email. I hope=20
> it's=20
> > to everyone agreement and satisfaction.
> >=20
> > "Dear OOPic Group Owner
> >=20
> > I have recently had correspondence with Yahoo! Groups Customer Care=20
> > with regard to the ownership and the lack of moderation of the=20
> OOPic=20
> > group. The group's moderator and owner are now absent from the=20
> list.=20
> > Also, the group settings are such that it is open to uncontrollable=20
> > abuse (eg Membership does not require approval nor do messages=20
> > require approval either). In order to effect good conduct in the=20
> > group I'm formally asking for control of the group in your absence.=20
> > Could you please reply via this email with your intentions=20
> regarding=20
> > the ownership of this list. Thank you.
> >=20
> > Mike Martin"
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > Novos endere=C3=83=C2=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=83=C2=AA conhece.=
Crie um email=20
> novo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail. com.
> > http://br.new. mail.yahoo. com/addresses
> >=20
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>=20
>=20=20=20=20=20
>=20
>=20
> Novos endere=C3=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=AA conhece. Crie um email
novo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail.com.
> http://br.new.mail.yahoo.com/addresses
>=20
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

------------------------------------



(You need to be a member of oopic -- send a blank email to oopic-subscribe@yahoogroups.com )

Thanks Helder - I've accepted Dennis' invitation to join the google=20
group so that I can make some preparations. Once I've figured out how=20
to control a group etc I'll be able to inform members of the move=20
across and kill off the spam once and for all.

Cheers
Mike M.

--- In o...@yahoogroups.com, Helder Oliveira de Castro=20
wrote:
>
> Mike,=20
>=20
> I've thought of "good/bad" things about a new group. I made up a=20
small list (please let's make this list bigger):
>=20
> Bad things:
> - [oopic] group has a huge amount of information, and in many times=20
I found the answers to my problems on previous e-mails. Besides, if a=20
newbie is having problems with an oopic based project, they'll=20
probably find themselves digging into [oopic] group to find what they=20
need. So it's really bad for freshers.
> - people have to change. If they keep on writing on this group, all=20
the effort would be in vain.
>=20
> Good things:
> - there would be an owner and a moderator, so no=20
more "freebies", "latest jobs", offense, useless discussions and=20
other unwanted messages.
>=20
> Come on guys, if you are really unhappy with the present situation,=20
please give opinions. As I sad, a new group would be a complete=20
failure if you don't give the necessary support now.
>=20
> Helder.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> ----- Mensagem original ----
> De: Mike Martin
> Para: o...@yahoogroups.com
> Enviadas: Sexta-feira, 29 de Agosto de 2008 8:00:32
> Assunto: Re: Res: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
>=20
>=20
> G'day Helder
> That's a good suggestion. I am thinking sbout it. I'm weighing up=20
the=20
> pros and cons. Can you think of any "good/bad/interesting" things=20
to=20
> say about a new group?
>=20
> Mike M.
>=20
> --- In oopic@yahoogroups. com, Helder Oliveira de Castro=20
> wrote:
> >
> > Why don't you create another Yahoo Group ([newoopic]) ? You could=20
> be the owner and moderator of this new group, and we could invite=20
> everyone to join the new group by using this oopic group.
> >=20
> > I really don't mind this change, what I can't stand are=20
> these "Freebies" and "jobs" messages, and you guys discussing for=20
> more than 2 months the future of this group. And look: and don't=20
post=20
> many messages here, I just use it because I'm working with a robot=20
> that uses ooPIC.
> >=20
> > Basically, I'm just a reader.
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > ----- Mensagem original ----
> > De: Mike Martin
> > Para: oopic@yahoogroups. com
> > Enviadas: Quinta-feira, 28 de Agosto de 2008 8:16:39
> > Assunto: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
> >=20
> >=20
> > Hello members
> >=20
> > I have received a reply from Yahoo Groups Customer Care regarding=20
> > ownership of the list. To be frank it was what I expected=20
> > (ie "contact the owner"). So as to make the best possible effort=20
> I'm=20
> > going to persist with the formal process until it's exhausted and=20
> > then determine what to do after that. To that effect I have=20
emailed=20
> > the owner asking their intentions. Whether I get a reply or not=20
is=20
> > anyone's guess. Below is a copy of the text of the email. I hope=20
> it's=20
> > to everyone agreement and satisfaction.
> >=20
> > "Dear OOPic Group Owner
> >=20
> > I have recently had correspondence with Yahoo! Groups Customer=20
Care=20
> > with regard to the ownership and the lack of moderation of the=20
> OOPic=20
> > group. The group's moderator and owner are now absent from the=20
> list.=20
> > Also, the group settings are such that it is open to=20
uncontrollable=20
> > abuse (eg Membership does not require approval nor do messages=20
> > require approval either). In order to effect good conduct in the=20
> > group I'm formally asking for control of the group in your=20
absence.=20
> > Could you please reply via this email with your intentions=20
> regarding=20
> > the ownership of this list. Thank you.
> >=20
> > Mike Martin"
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > Novos endere=C3=83=C2=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=83=C2=AA conhece.=
Crie um=20
email=20
> novo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail. com.
> > http://br.new. mail.yahoo. com/addresses
> >=20
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>=20
>=20=20=20=20=20
>=20
>=20
> Novos endere=C3=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=AA conhece. Crie um email=
=20
novo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail.com.
> http://br.new.mail.yahoo.com/addresses
>=20
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

------------------------------------



(You need to be a member of oopic -- send a blank email to oopic-subscribe@yahoogroups.com )

I wonder what would happen if the members of this group were to bombard=20
Yahoo with requests to make Mike the new owner? Especially if each=20
request were to be 'cc:'ed to the oopic owner e-mail address.

Just thinking out loud,

Stan
Helder Oliveira de Castro wrote:

> Mike,
>
> I've thought of "good/bad" things about a new group. I made up a small=20
> list (please let's make this list bigger):
>
> Bad things:
> - [oopic] group has a huge amount of information, and in many times I=20
> found the answers to my problems on previous e-mails. Besides, if a=20
> newbie is having problems with an oopic based project, they'll=20
> probably find themselves digging into [oopic] group to find what they=20
> need. So it's really bad for freshers.
> - people have to change. If they keep on writing on this group, all=20
> the effort would be in vain.
>
> Good things:
> - there would be an owner and a moderator, so no more "freebies",=20
> "latest jobs", offense, useless discussions and other unwanted messages.
>
> Come on guys, if you are really unhappy with the present situation,=20
> please give opinions. As I sad, a new group would be a complete=20
> failure if you don't give the necessary support now.
>
> Helder.
>
> ----- Mensagem original ----
> De: Mike Martin > >
> Para: o...@yahoogroups.com
> Enviadas: Sexta-feira, 29 de Agosto de 2008 8:00:32
> Assunto: Re: Res: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
>
> G'day Helder
> That's a good suggestion. I am thinking sbout it. I'm weighing up the
> pros and cons. Can you think of any "good/bad/interesting" things to
> say about a new group?
>
> Mike M.
>
> --- In oopic@yahoogroups. com, Helder Oliveira de Castro
> wrote:
> >
> > Why don't you create another Yahoo Group ([newoopic]) ? You could
> be the owner and moderator of this new group, and we could invite
> everyone to join the new group by using this oopic group.
> >
> > I really don't mind this change, what I can't stand are
> these "Freebies" and "jobs" messages, and you guys discussing for
> more than 2 months the future of this group. And look: and don't post
> many messages here, I just use it because I'm working with a robot
> that uses ooPIC.
> >
> > Basically, I'm just a reader.
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Mensagem original ----
> > De: Mike Martin
> > Para: oopic@yahoogroups. com
> > Enviadas: Quinta-feira, 28 de Agosto de 2008 8:16:39
> > Assunto: [oopic] Regarding ownership of the list
> >
> >
> > Hello members
> >
> > I have received a reply from Yahoo Groups Customer Care regarding
> > ownership of the list. To be frank it was what I expected
> > (ie "contact the owner"). So as to make the best possible effort
> I'm
> > going to persist with the formal process until it's exhausted and
> > then determine what to do after that. To that effect I have emailed
> > the owner asking their intentions. Whether I get a reply or not is
> > anyone's guess. Below is a copy of the text of the email. I hope
> it's
> > to everyone agreement and satisfaction.
> >
> > "Dear OOPic Group Owner
> >
> > I have recently had correspondence with Yahoo! Groups Customer Care
> > with regard to the ownership and the lack of moderation of the
> OOPic
> > group. The group's moderator and owner are now absent from the
> list.
> > Also, the group settings are such that it is open to uncontrollable
> > abuse (eg Membership does not require approval nor do messages
> > require approval either). In order to effect good conduct in the
> > group I'm formally asking for control of the group in your absence.
> > Could you please reply via this email with your intentions
> regarding
> > the ownership of this list. Thank you.
> >
> > Mike Martin"
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Novos endere=C3=83=C2=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=83=C2=AA conhece. Crie =
um email
> novo com a sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail. com.
> > http://br.new. mail.yahoo. com/addresses
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > Novos endere=C3=A7os, o Yahoo! que voc=C3=AA conhece. Crie um email novo =
com a=20
> sua cara @ymail.com ou @rocketmail.com.
> http://br.new.mail.yahoo.com/addresses=20
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>=20=20

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------------------



(You need to be a member of oopic -- send a blank email to oopic-subscribe@yahoogroups.com )